• Diplomjodler@lemmy.world
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    11 hours ago

    People always say the Democrats are out of touch. While that is certainly true, that’s not the real issue here. The Democrats know perfectly well what they would have to do to defeat Trump. It’s blindingly obvious, after all. The point is they don’t want to do any of those things.

    • madcaesar@lemmy.world
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      8 hours ago

      It’s partly that, but it’s also that doing what Democrats want never seems to get the turnout that it should.

      Biden did student loan forgiveness, which should have given him all the college votes, yet people shurg and go “Well yea! About time!”

      He puts money into infrastructures and unions and again, people go “I guess, it’s a bit better than Republicans!”

      Democratic voters suck ass at rallying behind any cause, because the base is filled with “well actually…!” people, that demand 100% problem completion on day one, otherwise they are not impressed.

      And even if he solved every problem ever, they’d say, “Well yea, he should fix them… He caused most of them!”

      Meanwhile, Republican voters will literarily vote for a rapist because they see the bigger picture. For as stupid as they are, they understand you have to be IN POWER to do anything.

      Twirling your thumb in your asshole pining about raising taxes and fist past the post and equality for all and protecting minorities is a colossal waste of time if you don’t VOTE.

      • Random Dent@lemmy.ml
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        5 hours ago

        The other thing I’ve noticed with Democrats (actually pretty much any group left of the Republicans) is that they’ll splinter off into a dozen different groups at the drop of a hat and all infight with each other harder than they’ll fight their actual opponents.

        The hard right is so effective IMO because they’ll glom together with people they don’t 100% agree with to push things in the general direction they want before they start arguing about the details.

        • monkeyslikebananas2@lemmy.world
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          4 hours ago

          But you don’t understand! Kamala was actually saying she would be personally killing Palestinian children with her bare hands or something! Clearly we should just stay home! - idiots

            • monkeyslikebananas2@lemmy.world
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              1 hour ago

              In a perfect system yes. Until then, let’s enjoy the show. eats popcorn

              If the plan is to tear it all down and build the perfect system, I’m down. I’ll subscribe to that newsletter.

      • WoodScientist@sh.itjust.works
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        6 hours ago

        Biden did student loan forgiveness, which should have given him all the college votes, yet people shurg and go “Well yea! About time!”

        He dithered and only reluctantly did this. And then when he did, he did it in a way that a corrupt SCOTUS could overrule. There were other paths he could have taken, but he chose the least-confrontational approach and ultimately the court negated most of his efforts. His fault or not, very few people actually ended up getting their loans forgiven. If he failed to consider a hostile SCOTUS in his plans, then that is a strategic failure on his part.

        He puts money into infrastructures and unions and again, people go “I guess, it’s a bit better than Republicans!”

        His infrastructure bills are currently being torn to pieces as they were slow to actually spend their money. They were mired in everything bagel liberalism. A thousand requirements for dollar spent meant to solve every social ill under the Sun. But regardless, these bills didn’t directly help individuals. They may be necessary to curb the rise of China, but that’s not something that affects people’s lives directly. Unionization? Biden was unable to stem the decline in union numbers, and he himself chose to be a strikebreaker.

        • Bytemeister@lemmy.world
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          5 hours ago

          He dithered and only reluctantly did this. And then when he did, he did it in a way that a corrupt SCOTUS could overrule. There were other paths he could have taken, but he chose the least-confrontational approach and ultimately the court negated most of his efforts.

          I’m gonna gut check this, because I remember him trying couple of times to work out student debt relief. Also, what other steps would you have taken to get student debt relief/forgiveness pushed though? The only step I can think of is after the “president is a king” SCOTUS ruling he could have just canceled them and told everyone to fuck off, but using those powers was clearly something that he didn’t morally agree with.

      • SoftestSapphic@lemmy.world
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        3 hours ago

        I think a big issue is people expect democrats to enact the thing’s they promise to enact and then they don’t. And there’s insane coping and denial used to justify it instead of allowing real critique.

        Biden did student loan forgiveness,

        Biden tried, no loans were forgiven, some loans were forced to be more ethical, but nobody was freed from the debt.

        So that isn’t seen as a win by a lot of people who wanted loan forgiveness and got a half assed attempt that didn’t help.

        Hell, he said he would forgive all student loans and make college free. Lol

        He puts money into infrastructures and unions and again, people go “I guess, it’s a bit better than Republicans!”

        Again, this isn’t really as true as I wish it was.

        They put money into green energy corporations that hoard it offshore like other corps.

        And Biden literally fought against unions while in office.

        Democratic voters suck ass at rallying behind any cause, because the base is filled with “well actually…!” people, that demand 100% problem completion on day one, otherwise they are not impressed.

        I try really really hard to not be contrarian about this shit, but Democrats aren’t making partial progress on anything, they are failing to make positive meaningful change for working class people at the expense of the rich, which is a requirement for fixing wealth inequality, which is the source of the vast majority of economic and societal issues. Until Democrats are willing to force their rich owners to make concessions they will not be capable of supporting these kinds of policies.

        Also blaming voters for the outcome of an election is not valid, it’s up to politicians to provide something worth voting for and being capable of communicating those policies to their target voters.

        Meanwhile, Republican voters will literarily vote for a rapist because they see the bigger picture.

        Republicans vote for strongmen because their religious upbringing makes them subservient to anyone who can imitate the way their pastor made them feel.

    • PugJesus@lemmy.world
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      8 hours ago

      The Democrats know perfectly well what they would have to do to defeat Trump. It’s blindingly obvious, after all.

      Is it? From a party whose voters want to go rightwards, now, wherein independents are already more right-leaning than that, and the only other major political coalition being even further right than that?

      “Just go left, we’ll totally win 😊” is the same line that got people fired up for Corbyn, who proceeded to make no headway in a country already much less right-wing than the US.

      Going left being better for the country does not equate to it being the path to electoral victory.

      • Bytemeister@lemmy.world
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        3 hours ago

        -Put conditions on any aid going to Israel.

        -Arrest trump and his sycophants in Congress for their litany of heinous crimes against the American people.

        -Force Biden not to run in 2024, have an actual primary and don’t put their thumb on the scale to nominate a corporate-owned bipartisan centrist.

        I’m pretty pro-democrat, but they could have done all that shit in a day and locked in the next 8 years of federal elections.

      • berno@lemmy.world
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        8 hours ago

        “Want to go rightwards” - are you fucking high?

        People want common sense approaches to social problems. The party stabbed Bernie Sanders twice in a row after shitting themselves because he was going to win the Democratic primary.

        More people I know who voted for Trump like and respect Sanders more than any other Dem candidate in the last decade because he’s authentic and true to himself and his beliefs. They don’t think his proposed solutions are going to work, but they’re willing to have a conversation and meet in the middle. The all or nothing ideologues running the Dems right now have no fucking idea what they’re doing, they’re trashing the joint - whether by malice or idiocy is moot at this point. Get these people OUT

        • PugJesus@lemmy.world
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          8 hours ago

          “Want to go rightwards” - are you fucking high?

          No, I just have the misfortune of preferring unpleasant data over feel-good circlejerks about how we’re TOTALLY the silent majority, despite all evidence to the contrary.

          People want common sense approaches to social problems.

          You do realize this is the exact line that right-wingers say amongst themselves about why people REALLY want a far-right corporatocrat theocracy, right?

          More people I know who voted for Trump like and respect Sanders more than any other Dem candidate in the last decade because he’s authentic and true to himself and his beliefs.

          Unfortunately, that transfers approximately not-at-fucking-all to electoral success in swaying them to vote for anyone but the fascist ghouls, in the same way that Nazi voters always knew one “good Jew” or modern American right-wing voters always know one person who “deserves” public services or is a “good” member of the LGBT community who deserves their identity.

          They’ll vote for the Holocaust all the same, but at least you’ll get an asspat out of it, right?

          They don’t think his proposed solutions are going to work, but they’re willing to have a conversation and meet in the middle. The all or nothing ideologues running the Dem right now have no fucking idea what they’re doing, they’re trashing the joint - whether by malice or idiocy is moot at this point. Get these people OUT

          “The REAL problem is that the current Dems aren’t willing to compromise and meet in the middle with the fascists!”

          Lord.

          And you say this is a LESS far-right solution?

          Jesus Christ.

          • berno@lemmy.world
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            8 hours ago

            Well ACKSHULLY wanting common sense solutions is right wing coded!

            Another 10 years of losses for you friend, gl. The vibe has been altered, these dipshit takes are going to deliver conservative rule for the next generation.

            • PugJesus@lemmy.world
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              8 hours ago

              Well ACKSHULLY wanting common sense solutions is right wing coded!

              Have you ever had a discussion with conservatives about what they think is ‘common sense’?

              Have you ever paid attention to how often conservatives discuss ‘common sense’ solutions that appeal to people who want to think that their deeply politicized views aren’t political at all?

              Do you know what ‘common sense’ is to fucking begin with?

              Fuck’s sake. It’s like talking to someone who’s voted GOP for the past 50 years of their fucking life but insists that they’re a ‘moderate’.

              Suppose you’re not going to answer about how Dems being ‘ideologues’ right now who won’t compromise, and how ‘meeting in the middle’ with fascist voters will totally be a less right-wing solution.

              Or about the data explicitly proving you wrong. But I guess I must be high.