What I find most fascinating/hilarous about this is “leftists” up in arms about this. This is like the most far left thing you can do other than actually seizing the means of production.
I am not exactly a leftist but I find the tariffs wonderful. Consumerism is a pox on the nation, this should fix this.
Why are we opposed to exploitation and pollution here at home but are ok when China does it because it allows us to buy a year’s worth of clothes every week for the price of single ethically produced garment??
Over leveraged billionaires are in trouble, BIGLY. If this continues they will be margin called and forced to start selling their shit. Of course the flip side is that liquid billionaires will come out of this richer than before. Probably the real plan behind this.
Also can we talk about how much of the economy was just fantasy? Billions, even maybe trillions of dollars of our economy is simply speculative value backed by mass delusion.
Turns out Trump may be a tankie after all.
The one problem is that it will not yield results within 4 years, so it will cause a whole lot of pain only for whoever is in power next to reverse it as soon as they take office. Hell this might not last till the end of the week for all we know.
I think, for ‘lefties,’ the trouble is that Trump is replacing progressive income tax with regressive consumption tax. Not that US tax structure was particularly progressive, but it at least pretended. Now, the low end of the income scale, living paycheck-to-paycheck, spending everything on goods & services it going to have to spend an extra 15%, straight to federal coffers, ,while corps get a 25% tax cut and billionaires get elimination of the estate tax.
It’s schadenfreude to see billionaires lose 10 or 20% of their wealth, but they still own all the factories. They’re still going to make money, and they will make up for production reductions by reducing workforce and eliminating 100% of many worker incomes. That is why all the economists are crying recession: consumption taxes reduce consumption, reduced consumption reduces employment, unemployment reduces consumption.
Right, that was a point I made in there somewhere. That the reality is that this will make billionaires more money which tracks with Trump. But even if that were somehow addressed the last part would still happen, it is a feature not a bug. The economic depression is necessary to burst all bubbles, and we have a lot of them, which in turn will make domestic production cheap enough that it is actually feasible. It does require the absolute implosion of markets and the destruction of all speculative wealth that exists in the system. The middle class will be the one to take the hardest hit in fact, not only because they will lose the value of their spending money, and their good paying jobs, but their retirement funds will be in tatters. Buuut if you see it through, at the end of the depression we should have a better functioning economy than what we have now. The problem is Trump simply does not have the spine nor the time to see it through and people really hate sacrificing the short term for an uncertain long term that doesn’t necessarily benefit them directly.
Anyways I think I rambled but I think the tariffs are actually a good very long term play if you are willing to cause a lot of shock and pain in the short term. We just don’t have the stomach for it, so maybe the artificially inflated economy is better. At least until the balloon pops anyways and we have no other choice but to suffer through the same depression but it is easier to stomach because there’s literally no other choice.
I mean, if you’re starting from the view that we have too many poor people for the number of billionaires, then killing off a bunch of plebs in a massive economic depression is definitely one way to balance the field. Just seems a little psychopathic to me, is all.
It’s definitely a MAGA theme, though: let bird flu run wild and all the survivors will be immune; crash the economy and all the survivors will be better off; throw out all the immigrants and every that remains will be comfortably English-speaking; jail all the protesters and everyone that remains will agree.
Funny enough, “Eliminate all competition” is what will turn a capitalist society into a dystopia. The free market isn’t so free when all the competition is gone.
Consumerism is a pox on the nation, this should fix this.
Leftism is when you fix consumerism by rendering common people too poor to buy shit. What a take.
Why are we opposed to exploitation and pollution here at home but are ok when China does it because it allows us to buy a year’s worth of clothes every week for the price of single ethically produced garment??
Well, first off, these tariffs aren’t focused on China. They’re hitting everyone, including countries with better labor laws and more environmental regulation than the US, such as the EU. Second, the tariffs aren’t conditional on countries making improvements, like if you want to argue we should have tariffs based on emissions per capita, that’s not an unreasonable position (although we’d have to tariff ourselves somehow), but that’s not what’s actually happening at all.
Not too poor to buy things, only poor enough that you’ll consider it twice before buying another plastic piece of shit you don’t need off of Amazon. It’s absolutely messed up that the ONLY reason we can consume as we do is because we moved all the pollution and exploitation to where we can’t see it, so that we can consume with a clean conscience. I don’t know how you can defend this shit, because I can’t. If your country’s economy depends on the exploitation of the people of another’s that just colonialism disguised as free market trade.
China was an example because it’s the most well known one. Second I never said that the implementation was good itself, I just think the concept of universal tariffs is very much solid especially in terms of ethics (which Trump somewhat frames it that way, of course his intentions are both bad and not well thought out so it’s only superficial ) with the caveat that it results in short term destruction of wealth which depending on the point of view is not so bad. I at least don’t think the levels of speculation in our markets is good and anything that pops that bubble is a good thing.
What I find most fascinating/hilarous about this is “leftists” up in arms about this. This is like the most far left thing you can do other than actually seizing the means of production.
I am not exactly a leftist but I find the tariffs wonderful. Consumerism is a pox on the nation, this should fix this.
Why are we opposed to exploitation and pollution here at home but are ok when China does it because it allows us to buy a year’s worth of clothes every week for the price of single ethically produced garment??
Over leveraged billionaires are in trouble, BIGLY. If this continues they will be margin called and forced to start selling their shit. Of course the flip side is that liquid billionaires will come out of this richer than before. Probably the real plan behind this.
Also can we talk about how much of the economy was just fantasy? Billions, even maybe trillions of dollars of our economy is simply speculative value backed by mass delusion.
Turns out Trump may be a tankie after all.
The one problem is that it will not yield results within 4 years, so it will cause a whole lot of pain only for whoever is in power next to reverse it as soon as they take office. Hell this might not last till the end of the week for all we know.
I think, for ‘lefties,’ the trouble is that Trump is replacing progressive income tax with regressive consumption tax. Not that US tax structure was particularly progressive, but it at least pretended. Now, the low end of the income scale, living paycheck-to-paycheck, spending everything on goods & services it going to have to spend an extra 15%, straight to federal coffers, ,while corps get a 25% tax cut and billionaires get elimination of the estate tax.
It’s schadenfreude to see billionaires lose 10 or 20% of their wealth, but they still own all the factories. They’re still going to make money, and they will make up for production reductions by reducing workforce and eliminating 100% of many worker incomes. That is why all the economists are crying recession: consumption taxes reduce consumption, reduced consumption reduces employment, unemployment reduces consumption.
Right, that was a point I made in there somewhere. That the reality is that this will make billionaires more money which tracks with Trump. But even if that were somehow addressed the last part would still happen, it is a feature not a bug. The economic depression is necessary to burst all bubbles, and we have a lot of them, which in turn will make domestic production cheap enough that it is actually feasible. It does require the absolute implosion of markets and the destruction of all speculative wealth that exists in the system. The middle class will be the one to take the hardest hit in fact, not only because they will lose the value of their spending money, and their good paying jobs, but their retirement funds will be in tatters. Buuut if you see it through, at the end of the depression we should have a better functioning economy than what we have now. The problem is Trump simply does not have the spine nor the time to see it through and people really hate sacrificing the short term for an uncertain long term that doesn’t necessarily benefit them directly.
Anyways I think I rambled but I think the tariffs are actually a good very long term play if you are willing to cause a lot of shock and pain in the short term. We just don’t have the stomach for it, so maybe the artificially inflated economy is better. At least until the balloon pops anyways and we have no other choice but to suffer through the same depression but it is easier to stomach because there’s literally no other choice.
I mean, if you’re starting from the view that we have too many poor people for the number of billionaires, then killing off a bunch of plebs in a massive economic depression is definitely one way to balance the field. Just seems a little psychopathic to me, is all.
It’s definitely a MAGA theme, though: let bird flu run wild and all the survivors will be immune; crash the economy and all the survivors will be better off; throw out all the immigrants and every that remains will be comfortably English-speaking; jail all the protesters and everyone that remains will agree.
Funny enough, “Eliminate all competition” is what will turn a capitalist society into a dystopia. The free market isn’t so free when all the competition is gone.
Leftism is when you fix consumerism by rendering common people too poor to buy shit. What a take.
Well, first off, these tariffs aren’t focused on China. They’re hitting everyone, including countries with better labor laws and more environmental regulation than the US, such as the EU. Second, the tariffs aren’t conditional on countries making improvements, like if you want to argue we should have tariffs based on emissions per capita, that’s not an unreasonable position (although we’d have to tariff ourselves somehow), but that’s not what’s actually happening at all.
No, he isn’t.
Not too poor to buy things, only poor enough that you’ll consider it twice before buying another plastic piece of shit you don’t need off of Amazon. It’s absolutely messed up that the ONLY reason we can consume as we do is because we moved all the pollution and exploitation to where we can’t see it, so that we can consume with a clean conscience. I don’t know how you can defend this shit, because I can’t. If your country’s economy depends on the exploitation of the people of another’s that just colonialism disguised as free market trade.
China was an example because it’s the most well known one. Second I never said that the implementation was good itself, I just think the concept of universal tariffs is very much solid especially in terms of ethics (which Trump somewhat frames it that way, of course his intentions are both bad and not well thought out so it’s only superficial ) with the caveat that it results in short term destruction of wealth which depending on the point of view is not so bad. I at least don’t think the levels of speculation in our markets is good and anything that pops that bubble is a good thing.
I’m not. Just because I don’t like Trump’s policies or approach doesn’t mean I’m supporting the status quo. They’re both bad.
Why should we place tariffs on countries with better labor laws where things are more ethically produced?
BASED